Ajaxtalk

Orange14 schreef: We have a much better defense than in years past; we just need to figure out how to score some goals.

Orange14 schreef:... Sure we need more depth up front and we never have found someone to replace Sneijder as an attacking midfielder. ...

Coach van Basten is still learning…

Marco van Basten looked back at his coaching experiences at Oranje and felt he needed to involve himself more pro-actively into the game. Last Sunday, against FC Groningen, he did just that and was rewarded…with a red card!

Van Basten’s thoughts went to the WC2006 and the EC2008 when he appeared to be totally overwhelmed by the activities on the pitch and “forgot” to act his part.

In Germany 2006, it was the brutal game against Portugal that slipped out of his hands. His stoic appearance at the touch line was highly criticized after that game. At the EC2008, it was ref Michel who gave a second yellow to Russian player Kolodin, only to pull it back after talking to his linesman. Van Basten watched it from the dug out and didn’t respond.

“Looking back, I have failed Oranje big time in that situation. Something happened there, something that wasn’t right. He gave that player a yellow for a fierce tackle. Even if the ball was out of play already, that doesn’t matter. And shouldn’t have mattered. We should have played the extra time against Russia with a man more. I was too passive. Again. I should have gotten onto the pitch to confront that referee. “How can you do this! I will report you…whatever… But I didn’t. It just overwhelmed me… I think that’s what they all mean with experience…”


The infamous incident: the red card was canceled for unclear reasons…

The shenanigans against Portugal at the WC in 2006? “That game got out of hand. It was one of the most exhilarating games I’ve watched. So much aggression, high pace, good football…it had it all. It took me totally in. I was mesmerized. It all happened so quickly. The first yellow for Mark van Bommel after ten minutes or so. I couldn’t even see what happened half the time. Was Mark headbutted? Did Boulah touch Figo? I couldn’t even tell. There was so much going on, I think I should have been a bit more involved, but I still can’t think of how… I mean, Scolari was only shouting abuse, I think, but I don’t feel that his behavior won Portugal the game. I think both Holland and Portugal felt they we’re handed the short straw, sincerely. I do feel the ref let that game get out of hand. Both Portugal and Holland never have had the reputation of being mean teams. Certainly not Oranje. Portugal is known to whine and dive and all that, but they want to play football, just like us. We missed a couple of good opportunities, they scored one. End of story.”

Last Sunday, against Groningen, he saw Vertonghen getting an undeserved second yellow. “I wanted to do something this time around. I mean, last week Cvitanich got an undeserved second yellow, so I thought: not again! I wanted to make statement, walk onto the pitch and wake that ref up.”

“You can’t protest yellow cards, only direct reds. So, we’re getting in trouble again I thought. I needed to act this time. I knew what I did was illegal, but than again, the ref clearly made a mistake too and I hoped we could learn eachother something.”

Referee Wegereef wasn’t impressed and sent the angry coach to the stands. “I respected the player Van Basten a lot, but as a coach he just needs to stick to the rules. And those are: don’t come onto the pitch. Simple. And Vertonghen reacted a tad too aggro in my view. I’m totally backed by international guidelines on this one. No discussion!”

Interestingly enough, Ron Jans - Groningen coach - walked behind Van Basten onto the pitch to try and throw his 2cents in. Wegereef missed that fact, so Jans walked a way without a card. “Jans on the pitch too? I hadn’t seen that. My linesman told me about Van Basten and nothing else.”

Ajax lost the game against FC Groningen and is trailing more behind AZ. “It was a crucial loss. We’re not longer in control now. We will need to wait and hope for AZ to drop points now.”

gordonvandekamp schreef:Here's a pretty good article/interview with van Basten that I think follows along the same lines as our recent observations:

http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/c ... rning.html

Portugal is known to whine and dive and all that, but they want to play football, just like us.

Over Pasanens Head schreef:If there is going to be a sacking (and like Ko I don't think that it will achieve much) then surely this time we must send an invite to Co.

GangstaRiB schreef:If if if if....

There is something structural wrong within Ajax. The squad isn't as good as we think they are. The current products of the youthsystem aren't as good as we think they are.

And still we demand championship etc etc.

We are the richest club in Holland, but we fail to have a consistent policy.

DanK schreef:

GangstaRiB schreef:If if if if....

There is something structural wrong within Ajax. The squad isn't as good as we think they are. The current products of the youthsystem aren't as good as we think they are.

And still we demand championship etc etc.

We are the richest club in Holland, but we fail to have a consistent policy.

Exactly. FFS, at least give vB until the end of the season, and lets see what we look like then. Half a season is not enough time to build.

gordonvandekamp schreef:I honestly don't get all the sack van Basten talk, at least not yet. He may not be a great coach, but I think we definitely need to see the season out with him and keep things in perspective. The season is not over, we're not out of ANYTHING yet, The reality is that we've only taken 4 points in the last 5 matches and we're fighting for 2nd place.

I agree we'd all rather be champion, but that's not a bad position to be in for a coach over half way through his first season. As others have mentioned, I think most clubs are too quick to pull the trigger and fire a coach. What's next, call for a firing after a team can't string together 3 passes? I understand if it's only bad performance, but this team does have some positives. It's not like we're close to relegation, we're still in a good spot.

We have the most goals in the Eredivisie (48, AZ/PSV are closing and only one behind). It's not like this is a bad team, just not a team meeting everyone's expectations. a team that's had a load of injuries and really only worked with the coach for half a season.

I think the most important thing is to give Marco time. See what happens this year for sure and then I'd even give him next year. You can't build a squad overnight and expect success, what team has proven that to happen? I don't know if he's a savior or can even turn this season around, but I do think he should be given time to implement his vision fully, which I don't think he's had yet.

I understand all the disappointment and frustration, and I think it's difficult to find out where to place the blame (players/coach/management), but I really don't think now is the time to start calling for heads. Wait until things are decided for sure for all that.

SE6Ajacied schreef: I agree that it would be ludicrous to get rid of MvB after so short a time and at this stage of the season

philippe schreef:

SE6Ajacied schreef: I agree that it would be ludicrous to get rid of MvB after so short a time and at this stage of the season

Yes ! Yes ! Let's give him time.

aveslacker schreef:

philippe schreef:

SE6Ajacied schreef: I agree that it would be ludicrous to get rid of MvB after so short a time and at this stage of the season

Yes ! Yes ! Let's give him time.

I reluctantly agree with this idea because I don't think firing our manager at the first sign of adversity is good policy, but I am more skeptical about Marco than I have been in the past. Besides, who is going replace him? It's not like there's a ton of quality candidates out there.

From: http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/t ... at-is.html

“I’m sometimes criticized for speaking my mind, but I must say that the influence of any coach is highly overestimated. I watched Marco during Vitesse-Ajax and I think he did all he could to keep his team on track. And that’s a lot, in his case. He surely brings quite a package to his club.

For starters, he was one of the best strikers in the world. He played for AC Milan, easily one of the best teams ever and played against the likes of Maradona. There are no players with more baggage like him. And he’s got a couple of years behind him as team manager. Experienced? Yes, I’d say so.

And still it’s hard for him to get Ajax going. He doesn’t really ponder throwing the towel, I can’t believe that. But he must be thinking: what else can I do? But, he’s the big man at the club and has carte blanche so he’ll never let his club down.

But he must see his players make the most stupidest mistakes and that must hurt his eyes. His win over Heracles was stolen and the 1-0 against Vitesse was also off side. As a coach, you’ll go crazy, but there’s nothing you can do.

Marco is not one of those explosive coaches. And I think - like he does - that that doesn’t help, all that running, jumping and yelling at the byline. Marco plays it cool, analyzes and coaches but now there’s all sorts of people saying he’s too passive. Those are the people that want to see him fail.

I don’t think he will. Van Basten won’t be chased away. Van Basten is a silent achiever. He works hard and will start again today. And he has one major advantage: next weekend, it’s Ajax-Feyenoord. That’s a game that hardly needs any motivating for. The media will hype it up, both clubs can’t afford to lose. And it’s a game in itself. Van Basten will use this game to get everyone 100% focused again.