Ajaxtalk

Was one of the lucky ones who was actually in the Wankdorf Stadium in Berne on Friday night and have to say what a joy to watch - reminded me of why I love football in the first place. Definitely amongst the top 5 games that I have ever attended.

Dutch got tactics correct in my opinion and the substitutions were inspired - the introduction of Robben for me turned the game at a time when France were clearly on top in terms of attacking football.

Maybe the Dutch wont go all the way but by god I think they have restored a lot of people's faith in the beauty of football.

Oh fuck, just remembered we have the Dutch in the WC2010 Qualifiers

The Purple Cow schreef:K-J hinted broadly on TV last night that he would play against Romania. I'm guessing van Basten will also want to rest Sneijder and v.d. Vaart. Also it makes sense not to play any guys with yellow cards - whoever they may be...

I'm guessing van Basten is going to follow the route Portugal took yesterday, and it makes sense since their already through to the next round too. I think it's wise to not risk the starters (of the first two games) and save them for the next round, it's still a pretty quality team with them on the bench.

So that should mean significant time for Huntelaar/Afellay/Heitinga/etc. The most important thing is to not get anyone injured/suspended as the game really is of little consequence at this point for Holland.

Kowalczyk schreef:Amen, brother.

It's a load of bollocks. Any system you play, you play because you think that's the best way to be beat an opponent. It's all about winning. And to some (including me) it's also about playing entertaining football. That's possible in many formations and I don't care which one Ajax and Holland play. As long as it's fun entertaining, based on skill rather than on physical power and as long as they win, I really don't care about the system.

If you believe a 4-3-3 formation gives you the biggest chance of winning a match, then play 4-3-3. If you believe some other formation will give you a bigger chance of winning, then go for that system. The system can never be a goal in itself. That would be extremely weird and stupid.

K.

I agree with all of this. My question is: does the average Ajax fan like to win more than they like the 4-3-3? Will they be upset if Marco deploys the 4-2-3-1 to Ajax (I've already been thinking about how he's going to do it)?

The good news is, I don't think Marco will give two shits if the fans complain or not. And I'm getting more and more positive about him taking over Ajax by the day.

You make the same mistake. It's not because the 4-2-3-1 that Holland does so well, it's because they have 5 excellent attacking players.

I would rather say it's because those 5 excellent players are at their best in this 4-2-3-1.

You are right. Ajax only has 2 outstanding attacking players

Exactly, Lucas. A team that starts with Ruud van Nistelrooy, Dirk Kuyt, Rafeël van der Vaart and Wesley Sneijder, and then brings on Arjen Robben and Robin van Persie (replacing a forward and... a defensive midfielder) can never be defensive.

'Counter-attacking' doesn't necessarily mean defensive, and a 4-2-3-1 is not necessarily less entertaining than a 4-3-3. Who cares about it?

K.

Kowalczyk schreef:Exactly, Lucas. A team that starts with Ruud van Nistelrooy, Dirk Kuyt, Rafeël van der Vaart and Wesley Sneijder, and then brings on Arjen Robben and Robin van Persie (replacing a forward and... a defensive midfielder) can never be defensive.

'Counter-attacking' doesn't necessarily mean defensive, and a 4-2-3-1 is not necessarily less entertaining than a 4-3-3. Who cares about it?

K.

The games against Italy and France are 2 of THE best games I have ever had the privilege to witness. Long live "Counter-Attacking" football if this is what in-fact it is.

Nothing beats Real-Ajax. But this is very off-topic

Italy lead France 1-0, France down to 10 men. Luca Toni is fouled in the box, leading to a red card for France and a penalty. The call could have gone either way, imo. I thought it was a bit harsh, but Italy always seem to do a good job of selling it.

aveslacker schreef:Italy lead France 1-0, France down to 10 men. Luca Toni is fouled in the box, leading to a red card for France and a penalty. The call could have gone either way, imo. I thought it was a bit harsh, but Italy always seem to do a good job of selling it.

It's now 2-0, France is out. How can France be so bad with so many good players is beyond me really, but well... Italy is through, fuck, that's annoying.

2-0 Holland. They go through with Italy, a job well done.

carcajou schreef: It's now 2-0, France is out. How can France be so bad with so many good players is beyond me really, but well... Italy is through, fuck, that's annoying.

Losing your best player, then playing with 10 men doesn't help. Personally I thought the red card was very harsh. Penalty, yes. Red card, no IMO.

Italy were good, but not great. They will have to improve to beat Spain, but then again its Italy. They can just dive in the box in the last min and win 1-0 in the knock-out stage to progress to the semis

Good to see the Dutch do their duty and beat Romania (who were quite disappointing). Italy - Holland would make an interesting semi final, but hopefully Spain will hand the Italians' collective arses to them in the quarters because I want to see Spain vs. Holland.

it's a shame Spain v Holland can't be the final. But it is possible it could be Germany v Holland...Sweet

From what I've seen so far, Spain vs Holland would be the 'dream game' of Euro 2008. As you say: shame it can't be the final.

If we go all the way, however, I think our opponents will be Sweden (quarters), Italy (semis) and Portugal (final).

As much as a like Spain and (seriously) the current crop of German players, I don't think they'll get past Italy and Portugal, respectively.

It's not a joke: I have much more sympathy for Germany and their current crop than for Portugal, who are - in my opinion - the most annoying team of the tournament (them and Greece).

As for Italy: they should be thankful that Holland didn't do against Romania what Italy surely would have done, in our position.

K.

It was obvious. Romania never looked like a team that was trying to win.

It was strange. Holland-B didn't even have to try hard.

And then it dawned on me.

Romania never looked like a team that was trying to win.




(insert Italian anthem)



- Disclaimer. Any resemblance to 'Calciopoli', such as more than one team considering this game a friendly, is purely coincidental. The fact that star players as Mutu and Chivu play for Italian teams is obviously not related to, for instance, Maldini senior's warning to Van Basten that a future coaching job in Italy and Holland not losing this game were indeed related. Romania, the team that during qualifying had allowed the Dutch only 1 of 6 available points, were simply too intimidated by the performance of Holland-A in the first two matches to show up in this must-win game. The very sight of Holland-B took the fighting spirit right out of them.

Not in the league of the 2 previous games but still enjoyable .The B team was still too good for Romania. Watching KJH , i am still not certain about him in the top leagues. Took his goal well and a back fick to Robben should have resulted in a goal .

* Holland are only the 7th team in the history of the European championships to cruise through their group with a 100% score (the 6th team to achieve this were Croatia, also at Euro 2008) and Holland are the first country to achieve this twice (first time was Euro 2000). The five at previous tournaments all made it to at least the semi-finals.

* Holland's goal-balance of 9-1 is the best ever at a Euro tournament. The old record was from 1984, when France made it through the group stage with a 100% score and a goal-dfferential of 9-2. Nine goals scored is also a record; no team ever scored ten in the Euro group stage.

* Klaas-Jan Huntelaar became the seventh Dutch player to score at Euro 2008 which (already!) equals the record for most different goalscorers from a team in the tournament history. Five of the six previous teams with at least six different goalscorers at the European Championship reached the final.

* Holland top group C with nine points; that's two points more than the other three teams combined!

* Holland are the only team in group C to finish with a positive goal-differential: +8. The group C team with the best goal-differential after Holland, is Italy: -1...

No matter how you look at it, these are some amazing statistics... (for what they're worth, of course).

K.

Thuram is looking for a club.

DanK schreef:

carcajou schreef: It's now 2-0, France is out. How can France be so bad with so many good players is beyond me really, but well... Italy is through, fuck, that's annoying.

Losing your best player, then playing with 10 men doesn't help. Personally I thought the red card was very harsh. Penalty, yes. Red card, no IMO.

Italy were good, but not great. They will have to improve to beat Spain, but then again its Italy. They can just dive in the box in the last min and win 1-0 in the knock-out stage to progress to the semis

Agree that the penalty call was marginal, but I'm pretty sure that if the ref is going to whistle for a foul in the box, since it was the last defender, he's also going to have to show the red. I personally think that Toni embellished quite a bit -- no surprise there. I wouldn't have given the penalty, but then again I'm pretty convinced that Italian players never get fouled, they only dive.

Either way, Italy's win is a sure sign that evil still exists in the world. Thankfully Oranje's play at Euro '08 is a sure sign that good still exists as well.

Russia is currently up 2-0 on Sweden in the second half and it's looking more like they will go through to the second round. Guus against his old team.

Nice to see Heitinga get the captain's armband and Huntelaar score for yesterday's game. Stekelenberg looked solid like he did all season, if not tested too much.

I also like the all orange look (shirt, shorts, socks) and wish that, or at least just the orange shorts, was used more.

Bring on the next round.

philippe schreef:Thuram is looking for a club.

and apparently might be going to Fulham (souce = The London Paper - News International London freesheet so might not be that reliable......)

Oh my God...

http://www.euro2008.uefa.com/news/kind= ... boulahrouz

K.

Kowalczyk schreef:Oh my God...

http://www.euro2008.uefa.com/news/kind= ... boulahrouz

K.

Just read that actually. Sad, sad news.