25 Feb 2010: Juventus FC - Ajax

[Orange14]

Enoh draws the first yellow from the run of play. Surprised he hasn't got one before this.

[souras84]

eriksen is out of it the whole game. as was pantelic

[orange goblin]

rommedahl should have started.
this said, I can live with that result without suarez. It will help us growing. the first leg we played really really well, dominant football. there's a future at ajax.
now let's focus on the Eredivisie.

[Orange14]

Well we didn't quit and actually created a couple of chances in the last 20 minutes. It was always going to be difficult to break them down when they had essentially five back in central defense. The Europe dream is over for this year. Let's carry the work on in the cup and league now.

[Philippe]

Bad first half, but very good second half.
Why didn't Emanuelson and Rommedahl play from the start ? Strange coaching. We were much better with them.
Pantelic turns out to have limited potential. Let's look for another striker for next season.

[Tom_]

Yep. Can't really complain about the way we played. Juventus had more individual quality than we did. Also (surprisingly, given that everyone on the pitch is a professional athlete) they were much much stronger than us physically. We were never going to break them down when they set out only to defend -- and certainly not twice. Really we needed a draw in Amsterdam so that we only needed one goal in Turin.

[Cedric]

That was sadly the expected scenario with this annoying Juventus. Ajax finally had the ball in the second half but had just no idea how to score or just to be dangerous...

[SPL]

Well that was one of the worst games of football i have seen . Our front 3 were non existant. Sulejmani may have scored a fine goal last week but he has done nothing else. Pantelic was woeful and other than a header off his line and a soft couple of shots Eriksen really should not have been playing certainly not for 90 mins.I do not think he is ready for this level yet . Juve are a poor team but they are still in a different class to Vitesse. Rommendahl should have started as he does have the experience .

Overall we held them tonight and should have won last week . We badly missed Luis of course. We now have to try and catch Twente and I think that will be very hard because they do not drop many points .

[Kilroy]

@ Orange Goblin

Which game were you watching??? I watched Juve - Ajax and you can not possibly have meant that one.

[Kowalczyk]

@ Orange Goblin

Which game were you watching??? I watched Juve - Ajax and you can not possibly have meant that one.

He's talking about the first leg... Ajax vs Juve in Amsterdam.

As for today's game: Ajax tried pretty hard (in the second half), but it just wasn't enough. We never scared them.

Oh well. Fair enough.

K.

[orange goblin]

thanks ko, you have understood. I was referring to the A'dam game, mate.

[Kilroy]

@ Ko: You can't be serious!

Okay guys, here is how to vote for Man of the Match on Ajax Network:

Match quality: 1 out of 10

Player #1: Luis Suarez (He saw what was coming and arranged for a day off in AMS)
Player #2: Kerlon (He wisely choose injury status when he saw what he was getting into)
Player #3: Ze Eduardo (Famous quote: "What game ? What stadium ?)

Hey, seriously, someone wrote that we should now concentrate on the Championship in the Eredivisie. Holy Cow, talking about reality . . . .

[orange goblin]

funny

[GangstaRiB]

@ Ko: You can't be serious!

Okay guys, here is how to vote for Man of the Match on Ajax Network:

Match quality: 1 out of 10

Player #1: Luis Suarez (He saw what was coming and arranged for a day off in AMS)
Player #2: Kerlon (He wisely choose injury status when he saw what he was getting into)
Player #3: Ze Eduardo (Famous quote: "What game ? What stadium ?)

Hey, seriously, someone wrote that we should now concentrate on the Championship in the Eredivisie. Holy Cow, talking about reality . . . .

Suarez was actualy in Turin....... he flew along with the team to give them some mental support...

[The Purple Cow]

It was men against boys, wasn't it?

For me, the most depressing part wasn't so much the tactical and strategic blunders, or even the players' technical incompetence. It was that Ajax played without flair or imagination. Surely Ajax, of all football teams in the world should show some originality of thought, rather than lugging hopeful high balls into the penalty box and hoping something would happen?

It felt like I was watching an English team in 1978.

There is absolutely nothing to build on here, we have been going downhill since Bosman, and it seems like nobody has any clue how to stop the decline.

[Orange14]

A lot of tough critics of yesterday's match! We seem to lose sight of the fact that this is still a very young team (I think 8 of the starters are 23 years and younger) against a veteran physical team (albeit with limitations compared to past Juve teams). It was always going to be difficult to score one goal (and two was highly improbable) given they started playing essentially five on defense (Felipe Melo was tasked with a central sweeper role and very rarely moved out from that position). Maybe if Rommedahl had started we would have been more threatening down the right side.

The central problem (and one that has been there for several years now) is that we don't move the ball with enough quickness in the midfield area and cannot create chances. de Zeeuw has good field visiblity, Enoh does not. de Jong is more of a withdrawn forward or attacking midfielder. I know we are not Barcelona but when you watch them, you see how the 4-3-3 should be played; quick passes and bingo they are in a position to create danger. We still don't have the striker to play this formation. Pantelic is on the downward slope of his career and he often has trouble holding the ball up when it comes in. I have no clue whether Suk, Castillion, or Bodul (how is he doing) will be the solution. I also don't know what Eriksen's best position is (midfield or wing???); he's also just turned 18 years old so we need to cut him some slack. I thought Sulejmani was somewhat decent yesterday given he got zero help from Vertonghen in terms of overlapping play or just getting the ball.

I too was disappointed in all the long balls that were offered in vain. We don't have anyone who is any good in the air so what's the point. I hope that we can keep some of the young players around for more than a couple of years (Suarez excepted as he's gone for sure this summer) as there is quality there and I think Jol can make something of it.

[SPL]

A fair post there Orange. I know it would not have made much difference but I still think Jol cocked up with his selection. Knowing that Juve are not going to have flying wingers Urby should have been left back . And before anyone says he cannot defend well we have a right back who cannot defend either.
Vertonghen should then have been CB with Toby . (Oleguer has played Ok but I rate the 2 Belgium lads better).

Rommendahl should have started against such a defence. Eriksen could have come on as a sub if need be.


Nb Slightly off subject.
The biggest frustration of Ajax is that we are likely to finish 3rd again and come the end of the season
which club out of the 3 will be raided the most by the big clubs? Affelay and Riaz may leave the other 2
but as for us we even have big clubs wanting to steal an 18 year old a month after his debut .

[orange goblin]

hope that we can keep some of the young players around for more than a couple of years (Suarez excepted as he's gone for sure this summer) as there is quality there and I think Jol can make something of it.

exactly my thought. we're both "orange" for something!

[Over Pasanens Head]

We seem to lose sight of the fact that this is still a very young team (I think 8 of the starters are 23 years and younger)

What was the average age of the 1995 side that won the CL?

[Orange14]

We seem to lose sight of the fact that this is still a very young team (I think 8 of the starters are 23 years and younger)

What was the average age of the 1995 side that won the CL?

Good question. Here is what I found out from this website: http://www.zanziball.it/en/28/5ea.html

I don't remember what the exact starting lineup was for the CL final match up. Blind and Silooy were the only players over 30. Kanu and Kluivert were both 19. Davids and Overmars, each 22. Everyone else 24 & 25. Of course this was in the pre-Bosman era, but still a very young team indeed. Many were from the Ajax youth system as well (Litamen was not and I think Overmars started out somewhere else as well). [added in edit] the website is missing Frank Rijkaard who whose last match was the Milan CL final. He was also over 30 (33).

Another edit Here is a better roster with birthdates and games played: http://www.ronaldzwiers.0catch.com/Ajax/1995.htm It still is a very young team!!!

[Kilroy]

Okay guys, here is how to vote for Man of the Match on Ajax Network:

Match quality: 1 out of 10

Player #1: Luis Suarez (He saw what was coming and arranged for a day off in AMS)
Player #2: Kerlon (He wisely choose injury status when he saw what he was getting into)
Player #3: Ze Eduardo (Famous quote: "What game ? What stadium ?)

Hey, seriously, someone wrote that we should now concentrate on the Championship in the Eredivisie. Holy Cow, talking about reality . . . .

Suarez was actualy in Turin....... he flew along with the team to give them some mental support...

We all saw him sitting in the dugout alright, but he DID indeed ARRANGE for a day off in AMS by getting that card!

[SPL]

Seedorf was just 19 also .

I do think there is more hope this season for the future and Jol must be given a couple of more years to sort the team out . His big problem is we are still producing the players for the big clubs. Suarez like KJH before was not produced here but was turned into a big player by us and will go . I will be surprised if Van der Wiel does not leave this summer. In the next couple of years Vertonghen Enoh and Alderweireld will go to bigger clubs. If we could keep these players for say 3years , not Suarez as he is bound to go , and Jol can bring through some youngsters like Eriksen and hopefully some of the current u19 or even u17 's and can buy decently then we will reach the top again.

[Orange14]

I wonder if the current financial difficulties as outlined in the UEFA report that was released this week will markedly change the transfer market. Would one of our players want to go to a mid-level (or worse) English team with no chance of European play or stay with Ajax. Look at what's happened to Zuiverloon and Donk for example. I suspect the opportunities will be limited. Suarez may be the last one to land a big contract but even there we will have to see what develops.

[SPL]

Man u have been told to sell 10 players this summer due to their debt. Liverpool have no money Arsenal wont buy anyone over the age of 16 , seriously they wont pay more than 15m euros for players.
Chelsea have not spent big this last year but may do so this summer . The big 2 from Milan are not spending 20m + so that leaves just the 2 Spanish giants and even Barca have cut down . Real are financed by the Govt aren't they??? They will spend big as usual.

Overall the big clubs will not be spending like they have done in the past . I would agree why would any of our players want to join a mid table EPL side. Vertonghen said last season he would only leave to join a really big club and not a team like Everton . Heits is now earning a bit more than he would do in Amsterdam but wont be playing in Europe for Everton next season . How long before he decides to return home?? He may be playing in England which is a stronger league but ending up at Everton is hardly a major club .

[Orange14]

Overall the big clubs will not be spending like they have done in the past . I would agree why would any of our players want to join a mid table EPL side. Vertonghen said last season he would only leave to join a really big club and not a team like Everton . Heits is now earning a bit more than he would do in Amsterdam but wont be playing in Europe for Everton next season . How long before he decides to return home?? He may be playing in England which is a stronger league but ending up at Everton is hardly a major club .

I like Everton as they have a good manager in David Moyes and our NT keeper, Tim Howard. Our winger Landon Donovan may sign on for the long term there as he has done quite well since coming over in the January window. I do hope he stays as he won't get any better playing over here. I would agree that they are not a top four team but I like their underdog status.