22 Oct 2013: Celtic FC - Ajax

[SPL]

Have to say Denswil's inexperience cost the penalty and the deflection was also unlucky .FDB said he thought it was a penalty.

Have to agree with Oranje's marks , Serero is very poor and Siem is not much better. Schone was better than them and he was only on for 15 mins. I too would have kept Fischer on as he was the best attacker. Siggy adds nothing and Hoesen should start the next game.

Celtic are not a very good side and we really should have beaten them but we did not take our chances.

If Moisander is fit for Saturday then maybe we should play Veltman at RB ,he has played there.V Rhijn was also very poor tonight and the way Samaras brushed him aside before the 2nd was defending at its poorest.

[Orange14]

What you say about proper football is right, Orange. In Europe, we're playing against teams that are not only better but physically stronger than us, but we are still trying to dominate possession and play attacking football. We know, and de Boer knows, that this is not the most efficient type of football to play against better teams, but that's the tradeoff we get if we want to see 'Ajax' football.

The problem I have with FdB is that I don't think he has the club prepared to play. It's obvious by now that every oponent is going to defend us exactly like Celtic did. Nobody moves around much to create passing lanes. At one point in the second half there were four Celtic playes within 10 meters of Veltman and yet were was the passing lane for him? If four players are on him that means there are six left to defend against nine from Ajax. When we did manage to break the pressure there were opportunities to score. I know I'm a broken record but our midfield is just not good enough; no handling speed at all. I know Fischer is selfish but he was the only one moving around to create some passing opportunities. Oh well, back to the league this weekend with a Saturday evening match against Waalwijk; let's hope they can score some goals!

[saddlerian]

Couldn't get on last night..too much traffic!!! Just as well, I was so BLOODY ANGRY!!!!

Serero cost us that game....what a miss!!! His reward should be a one-way ticket back to South Africa...he's NOT Ajax!!!

The commentator's curse struck again as watching on Aljazeera 3...."The two Ajax centre backs have only played a total of 23 times.....you wouldn't know it as they are playing so well!"......3 minutes later, Denswil makes a silly challenge and gives the penalty! If he had been quicker gone through with the challenge instead of stepping away, he might have got the ball as Stokes was on his way to ground!!!

Very poor performance after being the "better" team in the first 45 mins.....

Let's reverse this and get a better result at the Arena....Europa League is still on!!!

BUT......BYE BYE SERERO!!!!!!!

[paladinby]

We can still finish second in this group. We need to beat Celtic at home and hope that Barcelona beats Milan. And the who knows what can happen?

[Philippe]

We just had no striking power against a rather mediocre opponent. Let's bring in Hoesen in replacement for Sigthorsson.

Cillessen - very good
Blind - very good
Denswil - good in spite of 2 serious blunders
Veltman - very good
van Rhijn - very good but not as sharp as usual
Poulsen - very good
Serero - very good but unable to score
de Jong - good and hard working
Fischer - seemed lost most of the time
Sigthorsson - can't score, good at moving backwards
Andersen - very good
de Sa - invisible
Schöne - very good, and once again scored
Boilsesen - very good

[saddlerian]

We just had no striking power against a rather mediocre opponent. Let's bring in Hoesen in replacement for Sigthorsson.

Cillessen - very good
Blind - very good
Denswil - good in spite of 2 serious blunders
Veltman - very good
van Rhijn - very good but not as sharp as usual
Poulsen - very good
Serero - very good but unable to score
de Jong - good and hard working
Fischer - seemed lost most of the time
Sigthorsson - can't score, good at moving backwards
Andersen - very good
de Sa - invisible
Schöne - very good, and once again scored
Boilsesen - very good

I must have missed something!!!!
Cillessen - played well, did not get flustered when under pressure
Blind - Played with confidence....always looking FORWARDS!!!
Denswil - Played ok, but got drawn into too many schoolboy errors...needs vision!
Veltman - Played with plenty of confidence, BUT, could not move forwards as there was no-one to fill the gap!!!!
van Rhijn - Played as though he was a terrified schoolboy....scared of Samaras!!!
Poulsen - Cleared up plenty of situations BUT, not enough forward impetus!!
Serero - Tried hard but is not good enough....HIS MISS COST AJAX THE MATCH!!!
de Jong - Tried hard to lead but made the wrong decision too many times!!!
Fischer - Wanted to go forward all of the time, but FDB seen on TV to stop him after 16 mins...WHY????
Sigthorsson - WHO????
Andersen - Best game so far but needs to "muscle up"...too easily pushed off the ball!!!
de Sa - Tried in the short time on the pitch but it was all over then...too late!!!
Schöne - Should he have been playing instead of Serero? I think so!!!!
Boilsesen - Again, wanted to attack but brought on much too late!!!!

[SPL]

I would go along with Saddler Ian on his assessments. Serero is not good enough and both he and Sigthorrson are not Ajax material and need to be replaced. Maybe Siem should be played up front as he has a decent record over the past 2 seasons as a standin striker.

[Orange14]

de Jong is just not a quality midfielder in a 4-3-3. He's just too slow and doesn't have the handling speed (ability to see the field and get the pass off quickly). I think it's one of the reasons why we rarely attack down the right side of the pitch. When Eriksen was still with the club we had a way to get the ball into the midfield area and of course all the attacking began with balls down the left side. We don't have anyone who can replace him at this point and it's one of the principal reasons why the club is so easy to defend against. Denswil, Veltman and Poulsen/Blind are really hamstrung in that they don't have any outlet passes to make. Fischer for his faults at least moves into space to get the ball.

I have not seen enough of Duarte to judge whether he can help solve some of these problems and Schöne is really the only legitimate option at this point. I'm not so worried about our defense other than they are all very young (save Poulsen) and seem to be maturing pretty quickly. Sure there have been some blunders in the our CL matches but that is to be expected. They also made some very good plays. It's the lack of goal scoring which is more troubling.

[SPL]

Where do you see Andersen's best position ? I wonder whether he will be in MF as he is not a winger and clearly has a footballing brain and looks a real talent in the making.Still a bit frail and at CL level,where the opposition are alot more physical is easy knocked off the ball.

I too want to see more of Duarte before I can judge him but Schone must start instead of Serero. Klaassen seems a clone of Siem and at present in Jong Ajax Lobotka ,Bazoer and El Hasnaoui are all developing well but not yet ready for the first team.Meleg gets played as a winger but imo looks a midfielder ,again he is a work in progress.

[Orange14]

Where do you see Andersen's best position ? I wonder whether he will be in MF as he is not a winger and clearly has a footballing brain and looks a real talent in the making.Still a bit frail and at CL level,where the opposition are alot more physical is easy knocked off the ball.

I think he's a midfielder and I sense he has the best view of the field of any player on the squad. He's had some wonderful passes that should have led to goals. I agree that he needs some strength and like most of the other players has to realize that at CL level he cannot rely on guile to go around players. He was dispossessed a couple of times last night because he thought he was a Barcelona level forward. The only player we currently have who can regularly beat defenders is Fischer but he too often has his head down and doesn't see passing opportunities.

It's important for us all to remember that most of our players are 19-23 years of age and don't have more than a couple of years of first team football if that. Given this is the problematic midfield I think the club had done pretty well in the three CL matches played.

[Van basten]

Couldn't post yesterday duo internet problems, but i see, that Ian, SPL and Orange did it for me To summarize it:
1. Serero cost us this game and is just not good enough. He should never start again.
2. Siem should never play in midfield in 4-3-3 system. I'm ok with him playing as No.9 or maybe No.10 in 4-4-2.
3. Frank should try Andersen in midfield
4. Hoesen must be given chance over Siggy.

[saddlerian]

Where do you see Andersen's best position ? I wonder whether he will be in MF as he is not a winger and clearly has a footballing brain and looks a real talent in the making..

Now, before you all start laughing...I'll wait for the laughter to die down....but every time that I see Andersen, he is always looking for the next thing to do with the ball....when he's forced onto the wing, he can only look forward or backwards....he seemed to be given a more free role against Celtic and...this is where you will start laughing.....isn't that what a No 10 is meant to do? Look and present? Maybe he can be trialled at centre midfield in Young Ajax for a while....he may be frail, but he did manage to avoid tackles in the last two matches by side stepping...and then passing the ball diagonally forwards!!!!

Yes, it's very , but what the hell....there's no-one else!!!!

[Orange14]

Ian, I for one am not laughing and I think pretty much along the lines you just posted. You're correct that when he is on the wing his ability to see the field is limited relative to him being in the center of the field. He's the most creative player we have since Eriksen's departure and he's being wasted on the wing.

[SPL]

I am not laughing ,I asked the question about Andersen being in MF and its seems we all think thats where he should be playing.I seem to remember Eriksen started out on the wing in our first team but he was just 18 at the time ie a year younger than Andersen who is now 19 .

Of our current players I would have Poulsen/Schone(not sure we need Poulsen or a DM for the lesser games) ,Duarte and Andersen in MF ,with Fischer on the left de Jong or Hoesen in the centre and when fit Bojan on the right.Siggy can go and join Stoke or West Ham in January as he would be more suited to them ,he is not an Ajax player imo.

Orange made a big point when saying most of our team are aged 19 to23 and have not been first teamers that long. Inexperience is costing us in defence in the CL. The penalties in these last 2 CL games were down to inexperience imo.

Have to say V Dijk looked a decent defender and Ajax were interested in him in the summer for the same 3m euros price as V d Hoorn .Veltman and Denswil both look good prospects but V Dijk is far more advanced and complete as a defender than either of our 2 or V d Hoorn but not really doing himself any favours playing in a one team league .The standard in Eredivise is a lot stronger ie we have PSV ,F word and Vitesse all stronger than anything in Scotland apart from Celtic and they did not impress me as they are just a moderate team but very physical imo.