21 Nov 2012: Ajax - BV Borussia Dortmund

[Amol]

Alright Danny Hoesen. Another 3 to go boys.

[ofey]

C'mon people, did any of you genuinely think we could have won this?

[Orange14]

Amazing statistics: Ajax had 67% of the possession, completed about 650 passes, and outshot Dortmund 12 - 6 (both sides had 5 shots on goal) and yet was thoroughly thrashed 4-1. Face reality, there is just not enough talent on this team to compete at this level (aside from being able to beat or draw English competition). Passes are too slow and predictable, defensive lapses get too easily punished, and there seems to be no plan B when the normal routes to the opponent's goal are taken away. Nice consolation goal by Hoesen off a sweet pass by Eriksen but aside from our Danish players nobody else seemed to have a clue. How many touches did de Jong have in the match? I hardly heard his name called by the match commentator. We are a decent mid-table Eredivisie club at this point but no better. We are still ahead of ManCity by a point as they managed a draw at home against Madrid and I guess Europa League is still a possibility particularly as Dortmund can clinch first in the group with just a draw against the English team.

Not that it's worth discussing much, but here are the player ratings:

Vermeer (6) - could have done better on the second goal and his kicking was poor but he really had little to do other than receive back passes
Blind (5.5) - gave up the ball a couple of times and looked like he gave up on some plays as a result
Moisander (5.5) - solid match except when he totally lost Lewandowski on the 4th goal
Alderwiereld (5.5) - stuck his foot out when he should not have thus forcing Vermeer to scramble
van Rhijn (6) - at fault on the second goal but did go forward with purpose
Enoh (4) - silly fouls and poor on the ball, played up front of Schöne in the 2nd half as a result and did little
Poulsen (5) - other than at fault on the first goal had a very average match but came off at the half
Eriksen (7) - pretty solid game and was quite creative on the ball, he has to play in the midfield to be effective
Boerrigter (5) - a couple of decent crosses and that's about all
de Jong (4.5) - he is either a striker or on the bench; he cannot play in the midfield as he's just not quick enough
Lukoki (6.5) - quit thinking you can beat two man traps and you will be a terrific winger
Schöne (6.5) - other than Eriksen, he was the only player who seemed to understand that the ball needed to move forward rather than backward
Hoesen (6) - a little lucky on the goal as Subotic deflected it but I would like to see more of him
Fischer (5.5) - still a little lightweight on the ball but again seems to understand that the ball has to move forward

Away to Roda in what should be a winnable match and then PSV. I hope FdB understands now who should play and who should sit (though I fully expect the Captain to be on the pitch this Sunday )

[Orange14]

C'mon people, did any of you genuinely think we could have won this?

I fully expect us to win every game but then I'm often prone to delusions!

[Orange14]

@Orange: Do you have a grudge against Blind? I think he is the best on the pitch right now. he plays with heart and really looks before he passes, tries to get the play forward. You also often give him low grades, when I think he does fine.

Not true, I've become on of his biggest fans this season. He does go forward well but he also gives up on plays as he did today on at least three occasions. He is not the problem on this team. He's the left back until Boilesen returns (if he does), his only problem is a lack of speed.

[zeux]

@Orange: Do you have a grudge against Blind? I think he is the best on the pitch right now. he plays with heart and really looks before he passes, tries to get the play forward. You also often give him low grades, when I think he does fine.

Not true, I've become on of his biggest fans this season. He does go forward well but he also gives up on plays as he did today on at least three occasions. He is not the problem on this team. He's the left back until Boilesen returns (if he does), his only problem is a lack of speed.

I think Van Rhijn made more obvious mistakes.

But thanks for clearing up.

[Orange14]

@Orange: Do you have a grudge against Blind? I think he is the best on the pitch right now. he plays with heart and really looks before he passes, tries to get the play forward. You also often give him low grades, when I think he does fine.

Not true, I've become on of his biggest fans this season. He does go forward well but he also gives up on plays as he did today on at least three occasions. He is not the problem on this team. He's the left back until Boilesen returns (if he does), his only problem is a lack of speed.

I think Van Rhijn made more obvious mistakes.

But thanks for clearing up.

van Rhijn was more effective going forward which is why I gave him a slightly higher rating. What I didn't catch was where Blind was on the first Dortmund goal. I couldn't tell by the replay on the Sopcast Stream at all. I don't think it mattered in the end as it was Poulsen's man to mark.

[Tom_]

Poulsen has really been shown up for his lack of speed in the last two games. It's a problem against counter-attacking teams when we're pushed right up.

[Kowalczyk]

Borussia were great. What a strong side they are. Hats off to them.

I enjoyed the game.

K.

[SPL]

Well at least it was a better 2nd half and I would like the Lukoki,Hoesen Fischer front 3 to stay. Poulsen was way too slow in this game and Enoh shouldn't be playing he adds nothing to our team I am not a fan of him.Schone was way better and Eriksen played well thus we actually had a midfield in the second half.

Dortmund were far too good for us. Shows up the english premier league as Dortmund are a meer 9 points behind Bayern and we are 4th ,9 points off PSV and Real are several points behind Barca but Man City are still top in England.

[Philippe]

It's very difficult to win a football game with no goal keeper and no striker.

[Philippe]

Borussia were great. What a strong side they are. Hats off to them.

b]K.[/b]

That was a good laugh !

Possession (%) 67-33
Total attempts 13-6
Attempts on target 10-5

[King Litti]

Borussia were great. What a strong side they are. Hats off to them.

b]K.[/b]

That was a good laugh !

Possession (%) 67-33
Total attempts 13-6
Attempts on target 10-5

The lack of possession was a part of Dortmunds strategy. Every single Dortmund player knew exactly what they were doing. They had good movement and solid defending and then they punished us with counter attacks. Superb away game from them even though the scoreline was a bit flattering for them.

We on the other hand didn't know what we were doing. We had the same kind of trouble against VVV. Thank god they were not able to counter. We seem to lack speed and creativety to break down a strong defence.

[Kowalczyk]

It's very naive to focus on the possession percentage. They wanted us to have the ball.

We were well and truly beaten (slaughtered, in fact) by a team that I consider to be a 'dark horse' for a slot in the final.

K.

[souras84]

When exactly did we shoot 10 on target? Anyway, I went for a glass of wine after the game to forget. If we play like this against PSV we will suffer! Remember our humiliations in the past decade?

[Manneken Pis]

It's very naive to focus on the possession percentage. They wanted us to have the ball.K.

Bert van Marwijk said the same thing in the post game analysis last night.

He recounted from his time as a manager in Germany that his club had played a game with a similar high level of posession and shots domination and lost on a clinical counter attack. He said in the in the post match press conference then that his team had played well and were unlucky, and the German journalists thought this was a very funny thing to say.

[Orange14]

The lack of possession is easy to explain. 2/3 of it was a result of failed build up and inability to get the ball into the attacking third. Thus we saw lots of back passes to the central defenders and Vermeer. As I noted, Klopp is to be congratulated for his defensive strategy which basically clogged up the middle of the pitch with six players. Enoh and Poulsen simply are not good enough to make passes or handle the ball to break down this type of defense. We saw that Schöne did a decent job after the half in getting the ball and pushing it up with incisive passes. The other problem is putting de Jong in the midfield and having Eriksen move up as a false #9. This works against clueless football teams such as ManCity but against any team with half a brain it's doomed. We essentially had three midfielders in the first half who were inept. This is FdB's tactical fault clear and simple. Maybe there are some players in the youth system who can play the type of football that we all expect; this current group, crippled by bad tactics, cannot.

In terms of shots on goal, we had more than Dortmund but none of them troubled Wiedenfeller at all. I think there was one hard shot but right at the keeper. There were a good number of crosses by Blind, Lukoki, and van Rhijn but nobody to receive them. Having de Jong, who is our best player in the air, too far back to do anything is terrible. Maybe when Sigthorrson comes back things will be different but then we will have the continuing problem of de Jong in the midfield.

BTW, what exactly is Bergkamp's role other than sitting on the bench looking stoical? Here is a player well known for his offensive ability but I see no sense that he has any input at all.

[souras84]

Yes, yes, to Orange you listen! We seem incapable of reaching the opponents area so we cirlce the ball endlessly or throw it to the wingers and expect them to do the job against 2 or maybe 3 defenders. To cut such a defence requires GREAT skills. Enoh and Poulsen never had and will not have it.

Bottom line! When you want to play possession football as Frank wants us to play, you have to dominate in a good way and score before the others get you on the counter! It's as simple as that. I am still waiting for a good through ball in the area... when was our last one (against a good opponent)?

[Philippe]

When exactly did we shoot 10 on target?

http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague ... pitch-view