Ajaxtalk

Hello,, I am trying to figure out what would be Ajax´s all-time dream team. Any suggestions?

Be sure to include Vd Sar, Krol, Rijkaard, Litmanen, Neeskens, Van Basten, Keizer and Cruyff. They'll be on most people's list. For the other three places you can pick from about 20 or players. Names like Van Reenen, Anderiesen, Vasovic, Suurbier, Swart, Muhren, Lerby, Ling, Koeman, Bergkamp, Blind, De Boer, Davids and Finidi spring to mind but they will be more arguable choices.

great question. nearly impossible to answer. How can you compare a player from the early 70s team with the great squad of the mid 90s for example.

Its like saying who is the greatest footballer of all time? Everyone says Pele, or Maradonna. I never really saw them play so how can I say they were better than Van Basten for example? Plus the type of football is completely different.

Then what about players who played before Ajax become professional? There are no (or hardly) any footage of these players, yet maybe some of them should be in the list.

So then after all that I would have to include:
vd sar, rijkaard, litmanen, cruijff, neeskens and piet keizer and of course van Basten, maybe Bergkamp. But I really aren't the one to pick this as I have only really seen highlights of the 70s/80s teams, and only really started to be able to see Ajax (full) games from the early 90s.

Who would be the coach as well? van gaal?

I am sure this wont be a very big topic...nice one :D

The record book shows that Piet van Reenen scored 273 goals in 237 matches between 1929 and 1942. That should get him a place in the team.

But how would we know if there were goalkeepers, defenders, midfielders or wingers from the amateur era who should be in it too? There can't be any statistics anywhere that would make a case for them.

Also, we've had so many great forwards that it would be impossible to fit them into our usual formation.

It's impossible, especially because many great Ajax players from the past played on the same positions: Van Basten, Cruyff, Litmanen and Bergkamp, to name but a few, all played at the #9 and #10 positions, so only two of them can be in the team.

Most people feel that they should all be in the team, and start doing weird things, such as playing Litmanen at right midfield, Cruyff as the #10, Bergkamp on the right wing and Van Basten as a striker. That makes for a line-up that's a little bit silly, if you know what I mean. Squeezing as many offensive superstars as possible in the line-up, doesn't make it good team. It's 'cheating'.

If you want to make a relevant 'Greatest Ajax Line-up of All Time' you will have to make some very difficult and cruel choices. Here's an attempt...


------------------------- Van der Sar ----------------------------

Trabelsi --------- Blind ----------- Rijkaard ---------- Krol ----

-- Neeskens --------------- Cruyff --------------- Davids ------

Rep -------------------- Van Basten --------------- Keizer -----


Bench:
Stuy (goalkeeper)
Suurbier
Frank de Boer
Chivu
Bergkamp
Litmanen
Gerrie Mühren
De Cler :D

K.

ko, would you really say trabelsi ahead of say reiziger? or even de cler? ;)

ozzerdibazio schreef:ko, would you really say trabelsi ahead of say reiziger?

Yeah. Seriously.

K.

Kowalczyk schreef:

ozzerdibazio schreef:ko, would you really say trabelsi ahead of say reiziger?

Yeah. Seriously.

K.

AHAHHA, you didn't put Bergkamp in that team, man, and therefore it sucks.

That is one of the tough, almost cruel decisions I was referring to in my previous post. In his teenage years Bergkamp played as a right winger, but at that position he was nothing special. He was brilliant as a #10. That position - and no other - is his position. But as a #10 (playmaker behind the strikers) Johan Cruyff is my man. Cruyff also played as a centre forward in his younger years, but that position is for Marco van Basten.

In other words: if Bergkamp is not in the line-up, you will have to bench either Cruyff or Van Basten.

K.

Hell, as long as we're dreaming I would toss myself in there somewhere. :bis: But I guess that would be the Extreme Dream Team.

Kowalczyk schreef:That is one of the tough, almost cruel decisions I was referring to in my previous post. In his teenage years Bergkamp played as a right winger, but at that position he was nothing special. He was brilliant as a #10. That position - and no other - is his position. But as a #10 (playmaker behind the strikers) Johan Cruyff is my man. Cruyff also played as a centre forward in his younger years, but that position is for Marco van Basten.

In other words: if Bergkamp is not in the line-up, you will have to bench either Cruyff or Van Basten.

K.

I have never seen Cruyff play, but Bergkamp and Van Basten are my men. So I'd put Cruyff on the bench, just to show the whole world what a great team Ajax is to be able to afford that.....

Most of the fans here are too young to have seen Cruyff and likes play. So it's more hear say than personal opinions.
I think it would more relevant to discuss the last 10 years dream team.

.................van der sar
suurbier....blind..chivu.....krol
.........neeskens.....rijkaard
.....................cruijff
.overmars....van basten...keizer

how about:

------------Vd Sar----------------
---Reiziger---Blind---F Boer-----
-------------Rijkaard-------------
--R Boer--------------Seedorf---
----------Litmanen---------------
Finidi----------------Overmars---
------------Kanu------------------

And then Kluivert can come in from the bench late in the second half :yes: :yes: :yes: :xyxthumbs:

My dreamteam with players that I've seen play in the Ajax shirt:

Vd Sar

F de Boer
Blind
Rijkaard
Silooy

Davids
Cruyff
Litmanen

Olsen
Van Basten
Ling

Bench: Schrijvers, Koeman , Lerby, Seedorf, Finidi, M Laudrup, Bosman

philippe schreef:Most of the fans here are too young to have seen Cruyff and likes play. So it's more hear say than personal opinions.
I think it would more relevant to discuss the last 10 years dream team.

Interesting.... You mean the post '95 era? I'll give it a shot.

Lobont

Trabelsi, Oliseh, Chivu, Maxwell

Dani, Vd Vaart, Sneijder

B Laudrup, Huntelaar, M Laudrup

------------------------- Van der Sar ----------------------------

Suurbier --------- Vasovic ----------- Chivu ---------- Krol ----

-- Neeskens --------------- Litmanen --------------- Haan ------

Finidi -------------------- Van Basten --------------- M Laudrup -----


A lot of this is based on repuations though. Of the players I have seen in the flesh and was old enough to remember properly:


------------------------- Van der Sar ----------------------------

Trabelsi --------- Blind ----------- Chivu ---------- J O'B (when fit) ----

-- Seedorf --------------- Litmanen --------------- Davids ------

Finidi -------------------- Arveladze --------------- M Laudrup -----

bryan schreef:------------------------- Van der Sar ----------------------------

Suurbier --------- Vasovic ----------- Chivu ---------- Krol ----

-- Neeskens --------------- Litmanen --------------- Haan ------

Finidi -------------------- Van Basten --------------- M Laudrup -----

Uuuh bryan... Cruyff is not in your line-up. He's a better 9 then Van Basten(ok, maybe not), a better 7 then Finidi and a better 10 then Jari. I hope you have some hidden explanation for this? ;)

He might be better than Finidi, but I don't think he's better than Litmanen or Van Basten at 10 and 9. Litmanen did a lot of running and helping out in defence along with all the fantastic attacking play he did. People forget this. He was a complete midfielder. And Van Basten is a better pure #9 goalscorer than Cruyff.

I went for Finidi because he is more of a team player than Cruyff and doesn't have as big a mouth. :D

Academically you're arguments are pretty sound. But Johan is by far the best Eredivisie player ever. The fact that you can't handle players with a big mouth may not leave you first in line to coach an Ajax dream-team.

Why not Frank de Boer instead of JOB?

It was a toss up between Maxwell and J O'B for the left back position. I think that when O'Brien was fully fit and had full match fitness (for about two months in 2002/2003) he was just better than Maxwell.

I couldn't have Frank de Boer in my team because he might decide to piss off to Barcelona just as the season is about to begin. Too risky.

this is just impossible, i've been trying to make my own dream team and I came up with tons. For me Van der Sar, Blind, Litmanen, Cruyff, Rijkaard and Van Basten have to be there. Very interesting thread, it has made me realize how lucky and how proud we have to feel to be fans of this club, look at all those names! no team in this planet could beat those dream teams you guys have just posted ;)

Vd Sar
Reiziger

Blind
Rijkaar

Krol


Cruijff
Neeskens
Davids

Overmars
Van Basten
Bergkamp


Seedorf
De Boer
Litmanen
Rep
Chivu

bryan schreef:I went for Finidi because he is more of a team player than Cruyff and doesn't have as big a mouth. :D

Well that rules out 1/2 the players that ever played for our great team ;)

bryan schreef:

It was a toss up between Maxwell and J O'B for the left back position. I think that when O'Brien was fully fit and had full match fitness (for about two months in 2002/2003) he was just better than Maxwell.

Landon Donovan who plays in MLS and the US National team said in a recent interview he thought John O'Brien was the best American player ever when he was healthy, but he was just never fit. :nooo:

Looking back at these teams brings up something I find interesting, a lot of the players who won the champions league almost 11 years ago were so young then that they are still playing, although in various form.

van der Sar, Davids, and Kanu are still playing in England, Kluivert in Spain, Seedorf in Italy, the de Boers in Qatar. Litmanen in Sweden. And probably a few more I am overlooking. Now how do we get them back to Holland all at one time for their last season? :xyxthumbs: