The Official World Cup 2010 Thread

[Kowalczyk]

I guess it's time for this now!

K.

[jamcocteau]

Oh is that minor tournament on again

Ah well at least I got a friendly in Sweden in Stockholm to look forward to in August

[Kowalczyk]

Oh is that minor tournament on again

Ah well at least I got a friendly in Sweden in Stockholm to look forward to in August

You have one thing in common with most fans of the countries that did qualify: you're not going to South Africa.

K.

[bryan]

I see that FIFA are having difficulty selling tickets.

If Ireland were there instead of France, they'd sell at least 100,000 extra tickets.

Well, tough shit for FIFA.

[aveslacker]

I look forward to a long and entertaining sledging exchange with my English colleagues in the run-up to the U.S. - England opening match.

[Orange14]

Looks like a fair number of our first team players are getting preliminary call ups to their NT squads:
Denmark: Eriksen, Rommedahl
Cameroon: Enoh
Serbia: Pantelic, Sulejmani (!)
Uruguay: Suarez, Lodeiro
Netherlands: Stekelenberg, Anita, de Zeeuw, van der Wiel,

Too bad Belgium missed out as I'm sure our two central defenders would have been on their squad. I must confess to being surprised that Urby was not a provisional call up since he is a pretty versatile player and our squad is not especially deep.

[paladinby]

No Siem for Holland, but psycho Afellay is in.

Dutch strikers worry me most. Huntelaar had a bad season, Van Persie was injured for a long time.

[Orange14]

The biggest worry is the lack of depth other than the midfield. Oojier is too old to be reliable other than for 15 minutes if needed. I'm not sure that Gio can deal with speedy wing players that we will face and if either van Persie or Robben get hurt, where will the goals come from. I suspect that the starting XI will need to really carry the day and that we certainly cannot afford any defensive lapses.

[Mr_Holte]

What is the general opinion from Ajax fans on the Dutch National team? In England the biggest teams fans, couldn't really give a stuff, especially Man United fans.

For the record, I think England and Holland will be quater finals, or semi's at best.

[Michael_B]

I always enjoy WC's and EC's a lot. Very fanatical when it comes to 'Oranje'. Sometimes I even cheer for PSV or Feyenoord players

The QF against Brasil will be our Waterloo I expect.

[jamcocteau]

The QF against Brasil will be our Waterloo I expect.

Eh, unbelievable statement - who says either of these 2 countries will make it to the quarters, please at least show some respect to the nations you are playing against. I know that its not in the Dutch nature to be humble but some humility would not go amiss

[Orange14]

The QF against Brasil will be our Waterloo I expect.

Eh, unbelievable statement - who says either of these 2 countries will make it to the quarters, please at least show some respect to the nations you are playing against. I know that its not in the Dutch nature to be humble but some humility would not go amiss

I agree with this 100%. I suspect that this will be one of the most balanced WC competitions that we've seen. Some countries have great players but rubbish managers others have some good managers but players who are just above average. A lot is going to depend on the health of key players. I'm hard pressed at this moment to pick a favorite.

[martinkohout]

I'll be pulling for the Oranje, but since my father was born in Brazil and my mother in Italy I have a couple of pretty good fallback positions.

[Kowalczyk]

I think Holland have a couple of world class players upfront and a few really great ones in midfield, too. The defence, though, is a serious problem: old, mediocre, nothing special. And as someone else said already: not much depth in the squad.

To be honest I think there's a very serious risk that Holland will crash out in the first round. My gut feeling is that we will start the tournament with a surprise defeat to Denmark (which would not even be that suprirising, really). Defeat to Denmark would turn the other two games into must-wins. We beat Japan, but fail against Cameroon - and that's it.

I wouldn't be surprised.

And even if we make it through the group phase we won't really go anywhere, I think. Quarter finals at the very best.

As for the 'stars' of the tournament: the superstars of the previous (club) season are always disappointing during the World Cup, it seems. The stars of Euro and World Cup tournaments are, in many cases, players who have something to make up for: shit season, injuries, lots of bench-time, etc. The best example Holland have ever had was, of course, Marco van Basten in 1988 (just before the tournament he seriously considered staying at home: he was striker #3 behind John Bosman and Wim Kieft, he had had a shit season at Milan and Michels hardly even spoke to him; he felt totally unimportant).

Now, looking at the current Holland squad, I have a feeling a guy like KJH might resurrect, seize his opportunity and score a lot of goals. Robin van Persie might be great: he's fit, he's eager and he will want to show something. I wouldn't be surprised if those guys end up doing better than the Champions League superstars (Sneijder and Robben).

I think it's great news for Argentina that Messi crashed out of the Champions League earlier than expected and in a very frustrating way. had Barça won the Spanish Liga title and the Champions League with Messi as their undisputed superstar, he would have sucked at the World Cup.

K.

[Kowalczyk]

Wow, Germany will be without Michael Ballack in South-Africa. He sustained an injury in the F.A. Cup final against Portsmouth and it turns out it's pretty serious. No World Cup for him.

K.

[Monkey Tonk]

As for the 'stars' of the tournament: the superstars of the previous (club) season are always disappointing during the World Cup, it seems. The stars of Euro and World Cup tournaments are, in many cases, players who have something to make up for: shit season, injuries, lots of bench-time, etc. The best example Holland have ever had was, of course, Marco van Basten in 1988 (just before the tournament he seriously considered staying at home: he was striker #3 behind John Bosman and Wim Kieft, he had had a shit season at Milan and Michels hardly even spoke to him; he felt totally unimportant).

K.

Van Basten was just coming back from an injury. He was rested. Similar to Van Persie this time around.

That year, 1988, Eindhoven had just won the CL (or EC-1), and Ajax had reached the final of the EC-2.

I tend to look for rested superstars, or a bunch of internationals on the same team that just won a major international trophy. Rest or a shared conviction of invincibility.

[aveslacker]

The QF against Brasil will be our Waterloo I expect.

Eh, unbelievable statement - who says either of these 2 countries will make it to the quarters, please at least show some respect to the nations you are playing against. I know that its not in the Dutch nature to be humble but some humility would not go amiss

^^^^^ This.

[Scherrer]

The QF against Brasil will be our Waterloo I expect.

Eh, unbelievable statement - who says either of these 2 countries will make it to the quarters, please at least show some respect to the nations you are playing against. I know that its not in the Dutch nature to be humble but some humility would not go amiss

^^^^^ This.

What a BS, jamcocteau and aveslacker. Can't a person have expectations? Being respectful and expections are two completely different things. You look like a bunch of legendary calimero's...

[aveslacker]

What a BS, jamcocteau and aveslacker. Can't a person have expectations? Being respectful and expections are two completely different things. You look like a bunch of legendary calimero's...

It's good to be a legend!

Seriously, though, expectations are one thing, but this goes a little further than that. That statement is basically an assumption that Oranje will make it to the quarterfinal. I don't think there is a team out there that should assume that. It comes across as kind of arrogant.

[gordonvandekamp]

With all this talk of prediction, I made mine, and if anyone else is interested, I also made a group (sub-league as they call it) named ajaxtalk in case anyone else wants to join. You can do it in English or Dutch at the following:

http://wcpool.com
http://www.wkpoultje.nl

[Jinne]

What a BS, jamcocteau and aveslacker. Can't a person have expectations? Being respectful and expections are two completely different things. You look like a bunch of legendary calimero's...

It's good to be a legend!

Seriously, though, expectations are one thing, but this goes a little further than that. That statement is basically an assumption that Oranje will make it to the quarterfinal. I don't think there is a team out there that should assume that. It comes across as kind of arrogant.

So what we need to say is: There are no small teams anymore. Surviving the group stage will be great already and from then we'll just have to wait and see cause everyone can win.

[Scherrer]

What a BS, jamcocteau and aveslacker. Can't a person have expectations? Being respectful and expections are two completely different things. You look like a bunch of legendary calimero's...

It's good to be a legend!

Seriously, though, expectations are one thing, but this goes a little further than that. That statement is basically an assumption that Oranje will make it to the quarterfinal. I don't think there is a team out there that should assume that. It comes across as kind of arrogant.

You're an American? Don't you guys do prediction-things before great sport events? Something like what gordonvandekamp just started two posting above?

We in Europe do that quite often and when you do a 'pool' you will have to guess what you think is most likely. And looking at our (the Dutch) line-up, compared to the ones Denmark, Japan, Cameroon and Paraguay/Slovakia can present, no-one can say that we have not got the best players. That is a simple fact. Knowing that, why (really, WHY) can't one say that the quarter-finals will be the end for the Dutch team in South Africa? Why does one have to be shy/humble/unrealistic? Why can't one say what is most likely if you look at the pure quality of the squads?

Let's frase it differently, aveslacker. What should a Dutchman answer (according to you) when he is asked the question 'Where will the upcoming world-cup end for the Dutch team?'. Enlighten me.

[Kowalczyk]

@ Jinne:

I don't see the point of Jamcocteau and Aveslacker at all, to be honest... I don't think anyone was being arrogant here...

Oh well, whatever.

Holland in the quarter finals? Possibly. Definitely not in the semis, let alone anything crazier than that. As I said before: I have this vague feeling that Holland may crash out in the first round. If they start the tournament with a 'surprise defeat' against Denmark (which wouldn't even be that surprising, but a more or less realistic option) the remaining group games will be 'must-wins', which would be a very unpleasant thing, especially against Cameroon.

But if I weren't a Dutchman and had to make an unbiased, strictly objective prediction, I would say: Holland out in the quarters (possibly earlier; definitely not later).

K.

[Monkey Tonk]

A quick glance (not to be confused with an in-depth analysis).

I think this tournament is pretty much up for grabs. There are no real top teams. Spain would be the obvious favorite, but it is extremely difficult to win two major tournaments in a row. It's not just a matter of being good. You also need luck on your side.

There are about five teams that could win this, and Holland is one of them. At this point that is good enough for me. Let the chips fall where they may.

I like the fact that it will be winter, mostly because I don't want to see another Brazil victory. Whenever they don't have the advantage of extreme summer heat, their edge, naturally assumed to be based on their supreme talent, disappears like snow before the sun.

Fields, especially at night, may be hard. I have no idea what type of pitches can be expected in South Africa, but uneven surfaces do not favor technical teams, and do favor the worker teams. (Without Ballack, the worker team probably has no chance).

I'm fading Spain, Brazil, Germany, and England. I'm also fading the African teams due to lack of experience, although Ghana looks strong. Which leaves me with Argentina, Holland, and Portugal. Outside shot: Serbia.

Argentina has the wrong coach. Portugal has a tough draw, and may not go far. That leaves Naranja Mechanica. The Lions of Africa.

The only Dutch word that the whole world knows is 'apartheid'. I'm telling you... South-Africa owes us. ;)

[aveslacker]

You're an American? Don't you guys do prediction-things before great sport events? Something like what gordonvandekamp just started two posting above?

We in Europe do that quite often and when you do a 'pool' you will have to guess what you think is most likely. And looking at our (the Dutch) line-up, compared to the ones Denmark, Japan, Cameroon and Paraguay/Slovakia can present, no-one can say that we have not got the best players. That is a simple fact. Knowing that, why (really, WHY) can't one say that the quarter-finals will be the end for the Dutch team in South Africa? Why does one have to be shy/humble/unrealistic? Why can't one say what is most likely if you look at the pure quality of the squads?

Let's frase it differently, aveslacker. What should a Dutchman answer (according to you) when he is asked the question 'Where will the upcoming world-cup end for the Dutch team?'. Enlighten me.

Look, I don't really want to start some kind of polemica here or anything like that. While one can argue that Holland have the most talented players in their group (although you could never prove it as fact, since talent is a somewhat subjective concept), it is equally true that the most talented teams don't always advance (or even qualify, for that matter). Is it inconceivable that Holland (or any other team, for that matter) fail to make it to the quarterfinals? I should think not.

The statement "I think the quarterfinal against Brazil will be our Waterloo" is both a prediction and a loaded statement. If it were only a prediction it might read something like Monkey Tonk's statement.

For the record, I think it's quite possible for Holland to reach the quarterfinals. Oddly enough, I think their offense is more of an issue than people realize, while their defense is better than people realize. And I don't agree with this idea that Brazil somehow can't play well because it is winter. Pretty much every Brazilian player plays in Europe anyway. They shouldn't be afraid of a little cold. Their problem is the same problem that Spain, Argentina, Holland, Portugal and England will have: all of their key players will be coming off the tail end of long seasons and could be pretty jaded during the tournament.

Truth be told, I have no idea who is going to win. That's my prediction.