Players Leaving Ajax

[Orange14]

Last week Zivkovic said he realized that this is his last chance with Ajax and that he's prepared to fight for a place on the team. With Milik and Cassiera above him along with el Ghazi (who IMO is better as a striker) I don't see any role for him. Ajax think highly of Dolberg and we'll see how he does with Jong Ajax this season; I haven't seen enough to make a judgement.

Clearly Ajax bought Zivkovic too soon. They should have waited another year to see how he did with Groningen. Utrecht is probably a very good fit for him though given our recent history with Utrecht I can see him scoring a hat trick against Ajax!

[Ayman]

Dollberg maybe 18, but with 2 strikers ahead of him, I doubt he has a place in the future at Ajax.

[Cruijff]

Dollberg maybe 18, but with 2 strikers ahead of him, I doubt he has a place in the future at Ajax.

If he really is the next big guy, he will outplay both before he is 20 or 21.
If Milik will continue scoring a lot of goals, he'll be transfered already before Kasper Dolberg will become 20.

[Ayman]

Dollberg maybe 18, but with 2 strikers ahead of him, I doubt he has a place in the future at Ajax.

If he really is the next big guy, he will outplay both before he is 20 or 21.
If Milik will continue scoring a lot of goals, he'll be transfered already before Kasper Dolberg will become 20.

Let's hope not, Nigerian striker Bamgabouye was linked with Ajax, he is 18, give it another year he will mature. Assuming that Milik leaves at the end of the season, and Casierra does well. Hopefully there will be no place for Dollberg, and he can move on with his career, far away from Ajax

[Cruijff]

Let's hope not, Nigerian striker Bamgabouye was linked with Ajax, he is 18, give it another year he will mature. Assuming that Milik leaves at the end of the season, and Casierra does well.

Hopefully there will be no place for Dollberg, and he can move on with his career, far away from Ajax

Hopefully there will be place for Dolberg, hopefully he will turn out that good that he will become the best Ajax striker we've seen since Patrick Kluivert and Nwanko Kanu.

[Ayman]

The history of Ajax and the wave of Danes didn't exactly result in success, however, after they all had left, the good times returned to Ajax both in late 80s and early 2000s

[Cruijff]

The history of Ajax and the wave of Danes didn't exactly result in success, however, after they all had left, the good times returned to Ajax both in late 80s and early 2000s

We still had Danes on board when Jari Litmanen arrived.

I don't label in nationalities... Stefan Pettersson and Zlatan Ibrahimovic were both great strikers for us and both Swedish... but we also performed better in Europe without them than with them.

[Ayman]

The history of Ajax and the wave of Danes didn't exactly result in success, however, after they all had left, the good times returned to Ajax both in late 80s and early 2000s

We still had Danes on board when Jari Litmanen arrived.

I don't label in nationalities... Stefan Pettersson and Zlatan Ibrahimovic were both great strikers for us and both Swedish... but we also performed better in Europe without them than with them.

In our best season in Europe (last one), Ajax didnt have a single Dane in their squad. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002%E2%8 ... jax_season

As for Swedes in our team, that has no bearings, Ajax may have been more successful without them, but the season wasnt bad with them either.

[Orange14]

Well, we've been very pedestrian ever since Eriksen left. Whoops, he is Danish so maybe it is good that he's gone.

[Ayman]

Well, we've been very pedestrian ever since Eriksen left. Whoops, he is Danish so maybe it is good that he's gone.

You are talking individuality, I am talking collectively. Apples and Oranges.

[Cruijff]

You are also comparing apples and oranges, Ayman.

Because we have had many Danes in the past you can come up with figures for this nationality only. So you are playing a game we can not participate in.

In the 80's PSV Eindhoven did buy all our Danes and they also contracted Wim Kieft and Gerald Vanenburg with a background in Amsterdam. With these players quite fast they became Champions League / EC I winner in 1988. Ajax had to wait 7 years to become succesfull in Europe again.

When Ajax lost his position as a top team in Europe, it was still quite normal for worldclass players like Michael Laudrup and Brian Laudrup to sign a contract at our club. Also now we are unsuccesful in Europe, but I would wish players of that kaliber would choose te play for us.

[Ayman]

You are also comparing apples and oranges, Ayman.

Because we have had many Danes in the past you can come up with figures for this nationality only. So you are playing a game we can not participate in.

In the 80's PSV Eindhoven did buy all our Danes and they also contracted Wim Kieft and Gerald Vanenburg with a background in Amsterdam. With these players quite fast they became Champions League / EC I winner in 1988. Ajax had to wait 7 years to become succesfull in Europe again.

When Ajax lost his position as a top team in Europe, it was still quite normal for worldclass players like Michael Laudrup and Brian Laudrup to sign a contract at our club. Also now we are unsuccesful in Europe, but I would wish players of that kaliber would choose te play for us.

I am not saying Danish players lack quality, and I certainly wasn't refering to other teams. I was refering to Ajax and the Omen regarding the Danish wave and post Danish wave. This happened twice in Ajax's history, if Dollberg and Schone leave in January, provided Ajax are still in Europe, I am willing to bet they will have a better chance of going further than the knockout stages.

[Cruijff]

I am not saying Danish players lack quality, and I certainly wasn't refering to other teams. I was refering to Ajax and the Omen regarding the Danish wave and post Danish wave. This happened twice in Ajax's history,

WOW it has happened twice in more than 116 years Ajax history.

Ok, we did not have a lot of different periods with great European success, but you can't call it a real patron. It is just being superstitious.

Same sort of superstition like being a forum member here and then say 'since I didn't watch the games live they've started to win every match so I will not watch the next game against Twente or De Graafschap, cause then they might win again'.

[Ayman]

I am not saying Danish players lack quality, and I certainly wasn't refering to other teams. I was refering to Ajax and the Omen regarding the Danish wave and post Danish wave. This happened twice in Ajax's history,

WOW it has happened twice in more than 116 years Ajax history.

Ok, we did not have a lot of different periods with great European success, but you can't call it a real patron. It is just being superstitious.

Same sort of superstition like being a forum member here and then say 'since I didn't watch the games live they've started to win every match so I will not watch the next game against Twente or De Graafschap, cause then they might win again'.

This is on a much larger scale than a supporter watching a game or not, sorry but that was a poor analogy. But what happened with the Danish wave and post Danish wave, happened twice, not just once. Just look at the early/mid 80s there was a Danish contingent, then in season 1986/87, Ajax won the Cup winners cup, there was not a single Dane. Fast forward between 1997-2000, there was another Danish wave, by the time it was 2003 Ajax were in the quarter finals, and a whisker away from making it to the semi finals, without a single Dane. I could be wrong, however, its safe to say that the Danish wave at Ajax is over. Today Dollberg has no chance, since two strikers are in front of him. Schone has El Ghazi, or if he is sold, another winger in front of him, and behind him he has either Muric or Cerny, who can play on both flanks. We will have to wait and see. One thing is for sure, this coming season is unprecedented, in a different respect since Klaassen is 23, yet he is staying at Ajax. A play maker with his reputation and quality, would have left Ajax at his age. Cillessen, who was heavily linked with a move abroad this time last year, seems set to stay, despite rumours resurfacing that he would leave, remember Van der Sar and Stekelenburg left Ajax around the same age as him. Veltman is 24, Ajax generally struggle to keep players until they are 25, especially defenders, with the exception of Vertonghen, but that was the exception to the rule. Alderweireld, Vermaelen, Heitinga, Chivu, etc. And of course there is Milik, who looks set to stay at Ajax, despite the hype of a move away from the club. You get the picture.

[Ayman]

I am not saying Danish players lack quality, and I certainly wasn't refering to other teams. I was refering to Ajax and the Omen regarding the Danish wave and post Danish wave. This happened twice in Ajax's history,

WOW it has happened twice in more than 116 years Ajax history.

Ok, we did not have a lot of different periods with great European success, but you can't call it a real patron. It is just being superstitious.

Same sort of superstition like being a forum member here and then say 'since I didn't watch the games live they've started to win every match so I will not watch the next game against Twente or De Graafschap, cause then they might win again'.

This is on a much larger scale than a supporter watching a game or not, sorry but that was a poor analogy. But what happened with the Danish wave and post Danish wave, happened twice, not just once. Just look at the early/mid 80s there was a Danish contingent, then in season 1986/87, Ajax won the Cup winners cup, there was not a single Dane. Fast forward between 1997-2000, there was another Danish wave, by the time it was 2003 Ajax were in the quarter finals, and a whisker away from making it to the semi finals, without a single Dane. I could be wrong, however, its safe to say that the Danish wave at Ajax is over. Today Dollberg has no chance, since two strikers are in front of him. Schone has El Ghazi, or if he is sold, another winger in front of him, and behind him he has either Muric or Cerny, who can play on both flanks. We will have to wait and see. One thing is for sure, this coming season is unprecedented, in a different respect since Klaassen is 23, yet he is staying at Ajax. A play maker with his reputation and quality, would have left Ajax at his age. Cillessen, who was heavily linked with a move abroad this time last year, seems set to stay, despite rumours resurfacing that he would leave, remember Van der Sar and Stekelenburg left Ajax around the same age as him. Veltman is 24, Ajax generally struggle to keep players until they are 25, especially defenders, with the exception of Vertonghen, but that was the exception to the rule. Alderweireld, Vermaelen, Heitinga, Chivu, etc. And of course there is Milik, who looks set to stay at Ajax, despite the hype of a move away from the club. You get the picture.

[Cruijff]

Same sort of superstition like being a forum member here and then say 'since I didn't watch the games live they've started to win every match so I will not watch the next game against Twente or De Graafschap, cause then they might win again'.

This is on a much larger scale than a supporter watching a game or not, sorry but that was a poor analogy. But what happened with the Danish wave and post Danish wave, happened twice, not just once. Just look at the early/mid 80s there was a Danish contingent, then in season 1986/87, Ajax won the Cup winners cup, there was not a single Dane. Fast forward between 1997-2000, there was another Danish wave, by the time it was 2003 Ajax were in the quarter finals, and a whisker away from making it to the semi finals, without a single Dane.

Ok you are allowed to rate my comment as a poor analogy, but in my opinion yours is also. Yes the Danish just left Ajax around 2003, replaced by a big continent of other strangers (from Tunesia Trabelsi, Maxwell from Brazil, Hossam Mido from Egypt, an extraordinary guy named Zlatan, Steven Pienaar from South Africa, Andre Bergdolmo from Norway and also a guy named Jari Litmanen did return) and they've done well 1 season in Europe.
Not one piece of truth that it had something to do with playing without the Danish.

One thing is for sure, this coming season is unprecedented, in a different respect since Klaassen is 23, yet he is staying at Ajax. A play maker with his reputation and quality, would have left Ajax at his age.

I don't agree. If you have any ambitions, you should try to keep some of the more talented players and 'leader figures' at your club for a longer period.
Especially when it is a real Ajax boy like Davy Klaassen.
And especially when the same guy has missed more than a complete year of football because of a tough injury a couple seasons ago. Nothing wrong with Klaassen being captain of Ajax at least one more year.

[Orange14]

I don't think Schöne is a good comparison. He was already in the Dutch league when he came to Ajax. he's now turning 30 and has very little transfer value at this point. As I noted in my match reports last season he has really lost quickness. He is only a spot duty player these days and I expect that is what Bosz will use him as. He cannot play 90 minutes.

The first Danes came in the late 1970s with the arrival of Fred Arnesen and Soren Lerby. A couple more came in the subsequent years. Remember this was a transition period after Cruyff & Neeskens (and a couple of others) left for more money. Ruud Kroll was the only one who stayed on. Also, Morten Olsen came in to manage Ajax in 1997 and brought Michael Laudrup. there was unrest at the time because of the Bosman rulling and the de Boer brothers who said they were not going to leave Ajax changed their minds and pushed for transfers. I'm not sure the Olsen was at fault when results started to suffer and he did have a good run as Denmark NT manager.

[Ayman]

I don't think Schöne is a good comparison. He was already in the Dutch league when he came to Ajax. he's now turning 30 and has very little transfer value at this point. As I noted in my match reports last season he has really lost quickness. He is only a spot duty player these days and I expect that is what Bosz will use him as. He cannot play 90 minutes.

The first Danes came in the late 1970s with the arrival of Fred Arnesen and Soren Lerby. A couple more came in the subsequent years. Remember this was a transition period after Cruyff & Neeskens (and a couple of others) left for more money. Ruud Kroll was the only one who stayed on. Also, Morten Olsen came in to manage Ajax in 1997 and brought Michael Laudrup. there was unrest at the time because of the Bosman rulling and the de Boer brothers who said they were not going to leave Ajax changed their minds and pushed for transfers. I'm not sure the Olsen was at fault when results started to suffer and he did have a good run as Denmark NT manager.

Morten Olsen had bad tactics, this irritated the de Boer brothers. Especially Frank when he was deployed at Left back, instead of centre back. The quarter finals against Spartak Moscow was the last straw.

[Cruijff]

I'm not sure the Olsen was at fault when results started to suffer and he did have a good run as Denmark NT manager.

Morten Olsen had bad tactics, this irritated the de Boer brothers. Especially Frank when he was deployed at Left back, instead of centre back. The quarter finals against Spartak Moscow was the last straw.

After the weak 96-97 season with only a 4th place in the Eredivisie Louis van Gaal left the club and Morten Olsen brought attractive football, a league title with after 34 matches 112 goals scored, 22 against (+90, still a league record).

It was really nice to watch the Ajax football of the season 1997-1998.

Ajax, however, was not an European top team anymore. Even in the last, pretty weak season with Louis van Gaal we reached the semi finals in the Champions League. A year later de brothers De Boer cracked Olsen's strategy for the UEFA Cup quarter final against Spartak Moscow... which we've lost.

Years later Frank de Boer said: 'we were not fair towards Morten Olsen'. Frank did admit they had used Olsen's position to force the transfer.

The big money in Barcelona got in the mind of the brothers De Boer and also Louis van Gaal who became manager in Barcelona made them crazy. Van Gaal even got into Jari Litmanen his head who left Ajax on a free transfer to Barcelona in 1999 while Jari wished for years and years that he could stay at Ajax until the end of his career.

[Ayman]

I'm not sure the Olsen was at fault when results started to suffer and he did have a good run as Denmark NT manager.

Morten Olsen had bad tactics, this irritated the de Boer brothers. Especially Frank when he was deployed at Left back, instead of centre back. The quarter finals against Spartak Moscow was the last straw.

After the weak 96-97 season with only a 4th place in the Eredivisie Louis van Gaal left the club and Morten Olsen brought attractive football, a league title with after 34 matches 112 goals scored, 22 against (+90, still a league record).

It was really nice to watch the Ajax football of the season 1997-1998.

Ajax, however, was not an European top team anymore. Even in the last, pretty weak season with Louis van Gaal we reached the semi finals in the Champions League. A year later de brothers De Boer cracked Olsen's strategy for the UEFA Cup quarter final against Spartak Moscow... which we've lost.

Years later Frank de Boer said: 'we were not fair towards Morten Olsen'. Frank did admit they had used Olsen's position to force the transfer.

The big money in Barcelona got in the mind of the brothers De Boer and also Louis van Gaal who became manager in Barcelona made them crazy. Van Gaal even got into Jari Litmanen his head who left Ajax on a free transfer to Barcelona in 1999 while Jari wished for years and years that he could stay at Ajax until the end of his career.

Ajax were still a European team, they were odds on favourite to beat Spartak Moscow. They kept the nucleus of the team in 1997-98, i.e. Van der Sar, Frank and Ronald de Boer, Danny Blind and Jari Litmanen, along with strong addition to the team, also remember the CL 1995 was still in the memory of other teams in the same competition.

[Cruijff]

Ajax were still a European team, they were odds on favourite to beat Spartak Moscow. They kept the nucleus of the team in 1997-98, i.e. Van der Sar, Frank and Ronald de Boer, Danny Blind and Jari Litmanen, along with strong addition to the team, also remember the CL 1995 was still in the memory of other teams in the same competition.

True. Ajax still had some really good players.
But in 1997 the team had even more really good players.

At some moment topteams just fall apart. The golden Louis van Gaal team did finish the league at number 4, 16 points behind PSV and 12 points behind Feyenoord. They were just not hungry for succes and not a real team anymore. A lot of guys were not playing for the club anymore, but mostly for their own glory and for a very good contract abroad:
http://www.epsig.nl/sport_voetbal_nl_1996_1997.html

[Cruijff]

The first Danes came in the late 1970s with the arrival of Fred Arnesen and Soren Lerby. A couple more came in the subsequent years. Remember this was a transition period after Cruyff & Neeskens (and a couple of others) left for more money. Ruud Kroll was the only one who stayed on.

In a later period Ruud Krol also went to Italy to earn a lot of money.

Not really fair to say that Cruyff and Neeskens left for more money.
If earning a lot of money was the only motive in the career of Johan Cruyff, he would have left Ajax already in 1968. He turned down plenty of unbelievable options and salarees. His manager, also his father in law, went mad.

Johan stayed at Ajax until 1973, after winning three Champions League titles in a row. Then the work was done and time for a new challenge. But not only that, there was a lot of animosity in the team and there are some team mates you can really blame for this.

Several Ajax 1973 players became really arrogant, they thought they were pure world class even without Johan. The new coach had zero control at all, he had no clue what to do and just before the beginning of the 1973-1974 season with 1 vote difference they choose Piet Keizer as the captain.
Johan said "some of you players are the 'water carriers' of this team." His team mades said 'f*ck off, we won't carry water, we carry champaign.'

Drinking, partying and smoking more than 70 sigarettes a day was also a big thing in this team. Johan was also a heavy smoker, but going out until late and drinking did not have his interest. He preferred to stay at home with his wife and children.

So after making Piet Keizer the new captain Johan Cruyff went to Barcelona, a team he always had a soft spot for. The golden Ajax of the 1970's fell apart with a terrible 1973-1974 season. The coach got fired but when a lot of his former team mates got reunited with Johan Cruyff for the World Cup in 1974 they directly accepted his role as leader of the team again to play the Total Football.


Well.... a small history lesson for you.

[Orange14]

Well.... a small history lesson for you.

Well done!!!

[Cruijff]

Well.... a small history lesson for you.

Well done!!!

A shame for you overseas Ajax fans this book has never been translated to English:

[Orange14]

Elton Acolatse who never could break into the senior team is off to Waterloo in Belgium